Re: [EquisMetaStock Group] Re: MetaStock 12 EOD and Third Party Data

Sat, 03 Nov 2012 18:59:03 -0700 · MetaStock 12 - please read

Extesive list without much sunshine in it. Thanks for the time to create it.

One approach I have used over the years is to skip upgrades and their costs 
until there was something of value for me. Doing that I usually found it was 
actually cheaper to just buy new when I wanted the "new toy".

Considering the way many of the proactive brokers are providing free RT data 
and platforms which are rapidly closing the feature gap, it is not hard to see 
MS going the way gas guzzling SUVs.
D
EGO Sum Qua EGO Sum
Sempre Avanti

"Socialism is a philosophy of failure,
The creed of ignorance,and the gospel of envy,
Its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery.." --- Winston Churchill

________________________________
From: Rvalue1 <rval...@yahoo.com>
To: equismetastock@yahoogroups.com 
Sent: Saturday, November 3, 2012 7:51 AM
Subject: [EquisMetaStock Group] Re: MetaStock 12 EOD and Third Party Data

I am terribly disappointed in Metastock 12 and what it cannot do. It sounds 
like they are abandoning the community of users and their preferences in favor 
of going forward with their own online aganeda and data provider agenda. 
Attached below is a summary of pros and cons listed by one of the Metastock 
users group from the presentation made by Metastock recently.
As a user community we need to object strongly to Metastock regardiong version 
12; that we do not want to be washed out of using Metastock in the future with 
our older versions, as new computers and operating systems make our older 
versions obsolete. 

Pros
1) Sopposedly faster data access on charts due to improved data on demand
2) New data format. (Older *.dat and *.dop are not supported in Version 12)
3) Eikon replaces Quote Center product
4) Version 11 and 12 can be on the same computer.
Once version 12 is activated, Quote Center will not work withing 2 months.
Version 12 does not install in the Equis directory. 

Cons
1) Does not read any data on your C Drive and never will.
2) Without an internet connection version 12 will not read any charts at all.
3) Previous data formats are no longer supported by version 12 or later.
4) ESignal data vendor is no longer supported.
5) Once Eikon activated, Quote Center is disabled in 2 months.
6) The Dowloader does not exist any longer in Version 12 or later. 
7) Thomson Reuters claims Version 11 will continue to work, but at some point, 
there will be a version of windows where Version 11 will no longer work or 
prior versions of MetaStock. 
8) Any manual data entry you've done will never be able to be read with V 12.
9) Third party data vendors such as Worden Brothers and CSI, or Dial Data, OR 
even Excel imports are NOT supported by Version 12. Version 12 will never read 
that data and the data can never be imported. 
10) Your current C Drive files are useless and cannot be read by Version 12.
11) If your internet is down, Version 12 is not funcitonal. 
12) The Mark Leibovit VR Plug In and the Alph Omega Plug in is not compatible 
with Version 12. 
13) Future add ons and plug ins most likely will not be compatible with 
versions prior to 11. 
14) People using third party data vendors other than reuters and quote center 
will now have to pay for an additional data vendor to maintain what they are 
currently doing. 
15) Eikon is more expensive for real time data than Quote Center
Note: If you don't upgrade, and you are a subscriber to Ruters End of Day, 
Version 11 will continue to read data on your C Drive. 

--- In mailto:equismetastock%40yahoogroups.com, Richard Dale <richard@...> 
wrote:
>
> I have confirmed with Thomson Reuters that the ability to use "MetaStock 
> format" local data has been removed in the latest upgrade - MetaStock 
> version 12. It is locked down to only use Thomson Reuters data.
> 
> If you use a data provider other than Thomson Reuters, such as 
> PremiumData, or might want to consider a different data vendor in the 
> future, then you should NOT upgrade to MetaStock version 12.
> 
> If you do uprade, you will be locked into using the Thomson Reuters data 
> feeds.
> 
> 
> Best regards,
> Richard Dale.
> Norgate Investor Services
> - Premium quality Stock, Futures and Foreign Exchange Data for
> markets in Australia, Asia, Canada, Europe, UK & USA -
> http://www.premiumdata.net/

stuart		#1 Posted : Saturday, January 12, 2013 2:08:07 AM(UTC)
Rank: Newbie Groups: Registered, Registered Users, Subscribers Joined: 9/9/2005(UTC) Posts: 6		I have been a long time and happy user of MetaStock since Version 8. In selecting MetaStock as my preferred software, like many of you, I have invested money and countless hours in working with it. I am happy to stick with Version 11 for the foreseeable future, but in x years Version 11 will no longer work with Windows y. Equis's decision to exclude Local Data, and by implication other data suppliers and former official plugins like FIRE, would probably have happened without much effort on their part if we were in the late 1990's or early 2000's. If there is a chance that Equis could see the error of their decision, then we as a user community should take the opportunity to voice our displeasure. Much has changed since that time in the way of Social Media. It is far harder for Equis to avoid a vocal and united user group, especially if the result is negative publicity. The phrase "All publicity is good publicity" is no longer true in the age of Social Media and globalisation. If you have used Version 12, or know someone who has, please post your experience and thoughts. Here are a few ideas. FACEBOOK MetaStock has a Facebook group: https://www.facebook.com/metastock MetaStock Version 12 related posts at: https://www.facebook.com/metastock/posts/125172174301389 Post on BOTH the group's front wall and the Version 12 related page. Equis will probably remove the post on the front wall but at least they will see it. They seem to leave the posts on the Version 12 related page as they think it is fairly well hidden, which is the reason it should be advertised! Include the page link in Twitter tweets about MetaStock, blog posts, etc. TWITTER MetaStock is on Twitter: https://twitter.com/metastock A few hashtag ideas for your tweets: #MetaStock #Trading #Stocks #Charts #TechnicalAnalysis I suggest you tweet your experience and references to the Facebook MetaStock Version 12 page and the Forums mentioned below as they are publicly accessible. FORUMS The most popular public forums are: http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/equismetastock/ http://forum.equis.com/forums/3035/ShowForum.aspx BLOGS If you have a blog and have evaluated Version 12, blog about it. Finally, the January 2013 issue of Stocks & Commodities had a favorable review of Version 12. I have already done a letter to the Editor setting out the shortcomings and glossed over facts in the article e.g. there was no mention that an internet connection is required to run Version 12. If there are any subscribers to the magazine may I suggest that you drop an email to the Editor with your thoughts. Regards Stuart


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stocktrader8		#2 Posted : Saturday, January 12, 2013 2:55:00 AM(UTC)
Rank: Member Groups: Registered, Registered Users Joined: 3/28/2008(UTC) Posts: 10		For the benefit of Equis management, here is a series of quotes regarding the opinion about Metastock 12 from the masses (taken from the Yahoo Metastock forum). Each paragraph represents a separate user. Thomson-Reuters do not seem to be interested in developing and continuing MetaStock. Metastock is probably not a big enough money maker for them. Charging for the program and requiring that we are then charged for data is a bit expensive. There are just too many other charting/data vendors out there to keep paying what MS wants in their business model. GM seized the advantage when Ford would only sell black painted cars. It seems now that MS day in the sun has come and gone as well. Most brokers will provide both datafeeds and software platforms for free or nearly so if you only make a min number of trades per month. After all that is the point isnt it, chart so that you can make wise trades? Anyone just charting for a hobby should take up needlepoint! Certainly less expensive, in many ways! from ms10.1 to 12 there are not so important and revolutianary innovations so we can live very well without ms12 and its limits Pulling from the servers as needed does impact the Explorer. Previously when running EOD explorations from on-line, the time went from minutes to hours. This was accross a dedicated high-speed line. I am terribly disappointed in Metastock 12 and what it cannot do. It sounds like they are abandoning the community of users and their preferences in favor of going forward with their own online aganeda and data provider agenda. Metastock has been declining steadily since the original makers departed i.e. Steve Achelis etc. It is clumpy and outdated. The time servers are at the topnow and have let it all slide into obscurity. I reamin very disappointed and will slowly shift elsewhere. Hard to do after 10+ years with Metastock and have been a strong fan of theirs to the community at large... If they were smart, they would have taken inputs from a forum like ours and addressed the real wants from users like me. MetaStock has been famous for open solutions (data format and conversion, import/export of functions). Now they locked the door. It could be that I did not understand the program that well, but I think I did. Anyway, I could not see what Metastock 12 could do that Metastock 11 couldn't. I am looking to change from Ms as it gets more useless. A lot of brokers do just as good charts for free. Wow! With those limitations, I am sure the user base will shrink dramatically. Unless they decide to change, MS will eventually become a relic of the past (it is probably moving swiftly in that direction now). There are just too many other choices available rather than having to put up with so many limitations. I own an older version of MS that I rarely use. I have migrated to other sources that meet all of my needs. Equis has come to a crossroads,updating the program or updating the data feed? They feel that most users will stick with the program and enjoy the benefits of a cloud based data source. It offers no constant downloading and maintenance of the database, only longer exploration times, no way to incorparate the new database into other programs.They feel that a user will accept this tradeoff if he only does one or two explorations a day. This way they control and maximize the user cost. They really need to find new ways to increase functionality in the program or they will lose users to more modern software programs! Reuters and Equis know very little if anything about really trading. They sell prices and other information. Consequently there is no reason to think they will evolve into something more useful to this group. I can’t help thinking they are similar to Kodak who originally developed the digital camera but didn’t know what to do with it because they sold film. I am bitter and angry as I have invested years developing systems and techniques around this software. Only to see this go to dogs..... The S&C have just put out a. rave review of Metastock 12 would it not be an idea to give the uniformed a different view point of view. Bill. Editor@traders.com Longtime MS (v4 - v11) user just switched to AmiBroker. While conversion of all my templates/explorations/custom indicators/layouts is painful, it's also liberating as I know MS is now a dinosaur. MetaStock Software "Richard Siletti just saw your post on Windows 8. Sorry we haven't responded sooner. Metastock 12 and MetaStock 12 Pro were not developed to run in Windows 8. Having said that, Metastock 12 has been running okay in our testing thus far. Metastock Pro 12 will give you issues due to compatibility with the real-time data feed. We are currently working on this issue." I have no idea what Equis were thinking... Windows 8 was announced in late 2008. Maybe they didn't have enough time to accommodate Windows 8 and lock out local data. Note: not one comment praising Metastock 12.


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Mr Fabulous		#3 Posted : Monday, January 28, 2013 6:21:04 AM(UTC)
Rank: Newbie Groups: Registered, Registered Users, Subscribers Joined: 1/28/2013(UTC) Posts: 2		It's made me furious over the years not having tick charts, I don't even have to ask if it's been included yet because I've given up all hope.. absolute amateur hour guys


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JenniferH		#4 Posted : Tuesday, February 5, 2013 12:09:57 PM(UTC)
Rank: Newbie Groups: Registered, Registered Users, Subscribers Joined: 4/17/2009(UTC) Posts: 1		I too, have been a faithful user of Metastock for 10+ years and am disappointed in Metastock 12.0. * Still no version that will run on Apple products. * I used to be able to download data, take my portable and work at the cabin offline reviewing charts. This is not possible with 12.0 version. * Indicators do not use the most current data on higher time frame charts. For example, today is Tue Feb 5, 2013. If I plot stoch(5,3) on daily data today and then view on weekly time frame, the weekly stoch(5,3) only plots to the last full week, ie, Friday Feb 1st, 2013. That was not the case in version 10.1. It means I am running 10.1 and 12.0 in order to make my trading decisions. Why in the world did I bother to upgrade??????? Jennifer


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eddie.m		#5 Posted : Tuesday, February 5, 2013 7:23:45 PM(UTC)
Rank:: Advanced Member Groups: Registered, Registered Users Joined: 1/20/2012(UTC) Posts: 152 Was thanked: 1 time(s) in 1 post(s)		Quote: @stuart I have been a long time and happy user of MetaStock since Version 8. In selecting MetaStock as my preferred software, like many of you, I have invested money and countless hours in working with it. I am happy to stick with Version 11 for the foreseeable future, but in x years Version 11 will no longer work with Windows y. Hi there, Although I too dislike the move, we must admit that it is normal for Equis to want to increase revenue by eliminating the possibility for MS users to get data from other vendors. Perhaps Equis will revise their decision, perhaps not. We have to begin looking for another great charting software maker who does not sell data creating conflicts of interest, so we won’t be left holding the bag again. There are many software packages out there and the best of them do not even care to advertise massively … When everything else deteriorates, you must improve, if you are to win.


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John S		#6 Posted : Wednesday, February 6, 2013 3:32:47 PM(UTC)
Rank: Advanced Member Groups: Registered, Registered Users Joined: 11/9/2012(UTC) Posts: 169		I"m well aware of the concerns some have with MetaStock 12. As I've said before, I'm actively monitoring this forum. A big part of my job is to sort out new functionality for future versions along with prioritizing issues. While we won't be able to address everything for everyone, but know that we are better positioned than we have been in years to progress the product. Much of the new functionality we are considering is a result of feedback from this forum. We released MS 12 in September. Our first Service Release went out January 18th. MS Pro 12 users received this SR via the new Update Service (Tools>Check for Updates). MS EOD users can get it via our web site. I mention the update simply to highlight that we are able to address issues more quickly than ever. This will prove to be a big benefit going forward for everyone. John Slauson Product Manager


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aztrix		#7 Posted : Saturday, February 9, 2013 10:48:54 PM(UTC)
Rank: Newbie Groups: Registered, Registered Users, Unverified Users Joined: 5/11/2006(UTC) Posts: 4 Location: Sydney		Howzit John? Congratulations on NOT addressing your audience's major gripe i.e. local/independent data source, it might be politically savvy but it's irrelevant. You should run for political office. Cheers Bruce


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John S		#8 Posted : Monday, February 11, 2013 9:25:02 AM(UTC)
Rank: Advanced Member Groups: Registered, Registered Users Joined: 11/9/2012(UTC) Posts: 169		We are considering adding some form of support for local data (CSV files perhaps). "I am not a crook" --john


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eddie.m		#9 Posted : Tuesday, February 12, 2013 7:29:13 PM(UTC)
Rank:: Advanced Member Groups: Registered, Registered Users Joined: 1/20/2012(UTC) Posts: 152 Was thanked: 1 time(s) in 1 post(s)		John S wrote: We are considering adding some form of support for local data (CSV files perhaps). "I am not a crook" --john That will be just great! (No 'thumbs up' smiley?) Can MS v12 create composite securities?


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John S		#10 Posted : Wednesday, February 13, 2013 9:09:22 AM(UTC)
Rank: Advanced Member Groups: Registered, Registered Users Joined: 11/9/2012(UTC) Posts: 169		Yes. MetaStock 12 can create composite securities. (File>New>Composite Instrument.) ":-)" :-) --john


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eddie.m		#11 Posted : Sunday, February 17, 2013 6:03:10 PM(UTC)
Rank:: Advanced Member Groups: Registered, Registered Users Joined: 1/20/2012(UTC) Posts: 152 Was thanked: 1 time(s) in 1 post(s)		John S wrote: Yes. MetaStock 12 can create composite securities. (File>New>Composite Instrument.) ":-)" :-) --john Hello John, [:)] Thanks for replying. I do not have MS v12 and I was asking about the composite security feature just to see what's left out of Downloader. I'll skip v12 and wait for v13 in 2015 to see if the local data problem has been corrected for reasons I explained at http://forum.equis.com/forums/thread/39577.aspx (see my post of 2-12-2013 22:26) [W]


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ASSAD		#12 Posted : Saturday, March 16, 2013 12:47:26 AM(UTC)
Rank: Member Groups: Registered, Registered Users Joined: 3/16/2013(UTC) Posts: 12		Thank you , stock trader you are totally right and i agree with your view......you touch the wound but unfortunatley no body listen .


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ASSAD		#13 Posted : Sunday, March 17, 2013 8:03:22 AM(UTC)
Rank: Member Groups: Registered, Registered Users Joined: 3/16/2013(UTC) Posts: 12		Re: [EquisMetaStock Group] Re: MetaStock 12 EOD and Third Party Data Mr Distinque Sat, 03 Nov 2012 18:59:03 -0700 Extesive list without much sunshine in it. Thanks for the time to create it. One approach I have used over the years is to skip upgrades and their costs until there was something of value for me. Doing that I usually found it was actually cheaper to just buy new when I wanted the "new toy". Considering the way many of the proactive brokers are providing free RT data and platforms which are rapidly closing the feature gap, it is not hard to see MS going the way gas guzzling SUVs. D EGO Sum Qua EGO Sum Sempre Avanti "Socialism is a philosophy of failure, The creed of ignorance,and the gospel of envy, Its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery.." --- Winston Churchill ________________________________ From: Rvalue1 <rval...@yahoo.com> To: equismetastock@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, November 3, 2012 7:51 AM Subject: [EquisMetaStock Group] Re: MetaStock 12 EOD and Third Party Data I am terribly disappointed in Metastock 12 and what it cannot do. It sounds like they are abandoning the community of users and their preferences in favor of going forward with their own online aganeda and data provider agenda. Attached below is a summary of pros and cons listed by one of the Metastock users group from the presentation made by Metastock recently. As a user community we need to object strongly to Metastock regardiong version 12; that we do not want to be washed out of using Metastock in the future with our older versions, as new computers and operating systems make our older versions obsolete. Pros 1) Sopposedly faster data access on charts due to improved data on demand 2) New data format. (Older .dat and .dop are not supported in Version 12) 3) Eikon replaces Quote Center product 4) Version 11 and 12 can be on the same computer. Once version 12 is activated, Quote Center will not work withing 2 months. Version 12 does not install in the Equis directory. Cons 1) Does not read any data on your C Drive and never will. 2) Without an internet connection version 12 will not read any charts at all. 3) Previous data formats are no longer supported by version 12 or later. 4) ESignal data vendor is no longer supported. 5) Once Eikon activated, Quote Center is disabled in 2 months. 6) The Dowloader does not exist any longer in Version 12 or later. 7) Thomson Reuters claims Version 11 will continue to work, but at some point, there will be a version of windows where Version 11 will no longer work or prior versions of MetaStock. 8) Any manual data entry you've done will never be able to be read with V 12. 9) Third party data vendors such as Worden Brothers and CSI, or Dial Data, OR even Excel imports are NOT supported by Version 12. Version 12 will never read that data and the data can never be imported. 10) Your current C Drive files are useless and cannot be read by Version 12. 11) If your internet is down, Version 12 is not funcitonal. 12) The Mark Leibovit VR Plug In and the Alph Omega Plug in is not compatible with Version 12. 13) Future add ons and plug ins most likely will not be compatible with versions prior to 11. 14) People using third party data vendors other than reuters and quote center will now have to pay for an additional data vendor to maintain what they are currently doing. 15) Eikon is more expensive for real time data than Quote Center Note: If you don't upgrade, and you are a subscriber to Ruters End of Day, Version 11 will continue to read data on your C Drive. --- In mailto:equismetastock%40yahoogroups.com, Richard Dale <richard@...> wrote: > > I have confirmed with Thomson Reuters that the ability to use "MetaStock > format" local data has been removed in the latest upgrade - MetaStock > version 12. It is locked down to only use Thomson Reuters data. > > If you use a data provider other than Thomson Reuters, such as > PremiumData, or might want to consider a different data vendor in the > future, then you should NOT upgrade to MetaStock version 12. > > If you do uprade, you will be locked into using the Thomson Reuters data > feeds. > > > Best regards, > Richard Dale. > Norgate Investor Services > - Premium quality Stock, Futures and Foreign Exchange Data for > markets in Australia, Asia, Canada, Europe, UK & USA - > http://www.premiumdata.net/


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John S		#14 Posted : Monday, March 18, 2013 9:47:55 AM(UTC)
Rank: Advanced Member Groups: Registered, Registered Users Joined: 11/9/2012(UTC) Posts: 169		The majority of you Cons regard our removal of local data support. We will be adding support in MetaStock for local data. It will be able to read local folders/subfolders of CSV files. These could be files maintained, for example, in Excel. Or they could be data provided in the CSV format by third-party data vendors. Never say never. :-) --john


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wabbit		#15 Posted : Monday, March 18, 2013 5:13:30 PM(UTC)
Rank: Advanced Member Groups: Registered, Registered Users, Subscribers, Unverified Users Joined: 10/28/2004(UTC) Posts: 3,111 Location: Perth, Western Australia Was thanked: 16 time(s) in 16 post(s)		What about existing MS formatted data? And, as there s no limit to the length of a .csv file, will this mean you're removing the 65500 bar limit in charts? wabbit [:D]


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John S		#16 Posted : Tuesday, March 19, 2013 10:05:56 AM(UTC)
Rank: Advanced Member Groups: Registered, Registered Users Joined: 11/9/2012(UTC) Posts: 169		It will not read MS files directly. We have to make a break from this format for a lot of reasons (including technical ones). However, we will probably (I use this word a lot don't I?) provide a utility (other than the convert feature in The Downloader) to convert existing MS files to the proper CSV format. And yes, we will probably (there's that word again) , extend the 65,500 bar limit. This may (another form of "probably") not happen simultaneously though. --john


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Netto		#17 Posted : Monday, April 29, 2013 7:42:29 PM(UTC)
Rank: Newbie Groups: Registered, Registered Users, Subscribers Joined: 4/30/2013(UTC) Posts: 1		Having read nothing but negative comments about MS12 I will surely not be "up"grading. However, what I can't seem to find addressed is if MS12 has left the 1980's, and made things actually user-friendly and logical. For example - in MS11 I could have 2 years of annotations and markings on hundreds of charts and then decide that I wish to change my default template. This requires manually deleting the MSSMART folders, which also delete the thousands of annotations and scores of hours of work. When you call MS support, they can only say "that's the way it works". Well that's nonsense. Is the way it "works" in this regard fixed to actually make sense? Watchlists? I mean real watchlists, not creating a folder and manually moving one security at a time into it. Is this now in MS12 as it has been in other platforms for the last decade? Looking at the videos for MS12, it looks like that simply redesigned the interface, taking all the same stuff they had and changing how you access it; requiring their datafeed; if you don't have an Internet connection at all times well that's too friggin bad for you; and no local data. So where are the actual improvements? And the product manager who is replying to things here is just that - an understandable mouthpiece and nothing more. Not a trader. Not a usability expert. Not a technical wiz. Not working in Windows 8? Pure crap.


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owenhhowell		#18 Posted : Tuesday, April 30, 2013 7:32:49 AM(UTC)
Rank: Newbie Groups: Registered, Registered Users Joined: 4/30/2013(UTC) Posts: 1		I'm about to by a new PC and will get one with Windows 7 on it so I can run MetaStock 11. I bought 12 some months back and after one hour of discovery just don't like it so having used their products for 10 years plus it may be time to look over the fence.


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AJA1957		#19 Posted : Saturday, June 8, 2013 4:29:13 AM(UTC)
Rank: Newbie Groups: Registered, Registered Users Joined: 6/8/2013(UTC) Posts: 1		I have been using Metastock for years. Recently "upgraded" to 12 from 11. I cannot access any of my previous work. I have hundreds of stocks that I analyze and review regularly. Is it really true that Metastock 12 is not compatible with Metastock 11 smartcharts?


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MS Support		#20 Posted : Wednesday, June 12, 2013 3:57:43 PM(UTC)
Rank: Advanced Member Groups: Moderators, Registered, Registered Users, Subscribers Joined: 10/8/2010(UTC) Posts: 1,960 Thanks: 92 times Was thanked: 155 time(s) in 150 post(s)		AJA1957 MetaStock 12 can read the smart charts for online securities that were saved by MetaStock 11. The problem is, MS 12 looks in a different folder and has a slightly different format for the name. In general, there are three ways to migrate work from MetaStock 11 to MetaStock 12 1) If you do not have custom anotations on each chart: Under these conditions, you can copy the default template (default.mwt) from the MetaStock 11 chart folder to MyDocuments\MetaStock. it will replace the default template already there. Then when you open charts in MetaStock 12, they will be formated as they were in 11. 2) If you are using online data from Reuters Datalink but have many chart annotations: you can open the charts and then save them as regular charts (*.mwc files). You can then open those .mwc files in MetaStock 12. From there, you could re-save them as a smart chart if desired. This method will not work if you are using any other data source than Reuters Data link. 3) All other cases Open the charts in MetaStock 11 and save them as individual templates. name each template with the ticker symbol or security name it applies to. Then you can copy those templates to the My Documents\MetaStock folder. Open MetaStock 12 and apply each template to the correct security and then save that security as either a smart chart or a regular chart. We understand that the third method is not ideal. It can take awhile if you have a large number of securities you look at. However, it is the best way to preserve all the custom notations you may have on your chart.


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Re: [EquisMetaStock Group] Re: MetaStock 12 EOD and Third Party Data